Curse

Rites · Feb 24, 2011, 09:37 PM // 21:37

Harrier's grasp: Flash Enchantment Spell. For 5...17...20 seconds, attacks against moving foes also[sic] Cripple that foe for 3...13...15 seconds. When you cast this spell, you lose Cripple and 1 other condition. 10e/15 recharge

Compared to:
Crippling shot: Elite Bow Attack. If Crippling Shot hits, your target becomes Crippled for 1...9...11 second[s]. This attack cannot be blocked. 10e/4 recharge

Pin down: Bow Attack. If Pin Down hits, your target is Crippled for 3...13...15 seconds. 15e/8recharge

Melandru's shot: Elite Bow Attack. If this attack hits, your target bleeds for 5...21...25 seconds. If it hits a foe that is moving or knocked down, that foe takes +10...22...25 damage and is crippled for 5...13...15 seconds. 5e/1 cast/ 10 recharge

With harrier's grasp, its instant and there is no "prep" animation, plus at 9 wind it lasts 14 seconds. Since it is not a preparation, you could even throw this in with a barrage to cripple multiple enemies.

Thoughts?

Edit: Ran a test in PvP

bar had barbed arrows, incendiary arrows, poison tipped signet, harrier's haste and some random junk

with incendiary arrows you can hit up to 3 targets with cripple, burning, and bleeding (if barbs is active)
and until the enchant is removed (after 5 runs in JQ, my enchant was never removed) thats a constant cripple attack until the enchant ends

have yet to test in PvE with barrage, will be doing that next

@sonofthort
understood, but keep in mind that once aggroed most enemies are always moving, and if it doesn't stick with the first shot, you still have at least 3 more barrages before the enchant ends.
as far as enchant removal, i have only tested in JQ and after 5 runs, it was never removed.
for PvE, i was thinking of adding guided weapon on one of my heros to circumvent possible blocking

edit2:

after a few runs through PvE kourna and vabbi areas (mainly heket and kournans were my targets since they ran more) i found AoE crippling was pretty good, made it easier to control the mobs and yes foxbat with splinter thrown in it was nice

@foxbat
including runes i ended up with 9exp/12marks/7wild/10wind. the point spreads did not impede the usual needs of a ranger in JQ. though yes i agree it is a lil expensive energy wise, but then again so are all the other cripple skills normally used, the only difference is that expertise can't lower this one (which is only a marginal difference anyway)

Quote:

Originally Posted by sonofthort

My comment was more directed for PvP. There isn't really a huge demand for conditional cripple in PvE imo.

Anyways, I think there would be good att spreads for this.

Expertise: 11+2+1
Marksmanship: 8+1
Wilderness: 6+1
Wind: 10

Gives you just a long enough duration to perma harrier's grasp, and you want a long duration cus of the energy cost. 14 expertise is to help your energy. The idea is that this would make a good spread for an incendiary arrows build with apply poison. Imagine spreading burning, cripple, and poison to 3 foes nearby each other /drool.

agreed. but i must comment that expertise won't lower energy cost of harrier's at all, i was using a zealous bow and it helped my energy usage. oh, and i prefer bleeding and poison tipped sig (for that extra kick on one foe) but i guess apply poison would be quite similar. i prefer the 12 total in marks so i can do 100% damage over 75% (i believe) with only having 9. expertise bonus is rounded down, thus there really isnt much of a difference between 12 and 9 expertise bonus wise.

sonofthort · Feb 24, 2011, 10:28 PM // 22:28

I can see it as being an effective choice, especially considering it frees up your elite spot so you can potentially do AoE cripple.

The problem is that it is much more conditional than say crippling shot and pindown. You are vulnerable to enchantment removal, your targets must already be moving, and crippling shot is unblockable, meaning you have the ability to cripple through blocking with only one skill. To do the same with derv you would need an additional unblockable bow attack, but you would still be limited by the fact that the target must be moving.

FoxBat · Feb 25, 2011, 12:31 AM // 00:31

As far as PvE goes there isn't a real comparison here. If you wanted cripple for some reason, and have splinter from another source, this is how to do it. You should never waste your elite on single-shot cripple in PvE.

As for PvP I'm concerned how you are spreading your attributes. Seems like you'd have to give up an effective wilderness to get the cripple up there, and it's also very expensive. This could be alright in JQ to allow a shrine-killer ranger some carrier harass power that can go through multiple condition removals.

sonofthort · Feb 25, 2011, 02:08 AM // 02:08

My comment was more directed for PvP. There isn't really a huge demand for conditional cripple in PvE imo.

Anyways, I think there would be good att spreads for this.

Expertise: 11+2+1
Marksmanship: 8+1
Wilderness: 6+1
Wind: 10

Gives you just a long enough duration to perma harrier's grasp, and you want a long duration cus of the energy cost. 14 expertise is to help your energy. The idea is that this would make a good spread for an incendiary arrows build with apply poison. Imagine spreading burning, cripple, and poison to 3 foes nearby each other /drool.

I don't think barrage would have much synergy in pvp since real players rarely clump into adjacent range, and it removes your preps. In jq it would be pointless to harrier grasp barrage shrines since the NPCs don't move most of the time anyways.

Zodiac Meteor · Feb 25, 2011, 05:16 AM // 05:16

I loved the fact they NERFED crippling shot because it was to OP.

The skill is already pretty beastly on Assassin. But in PvP games like HA or GvG this takes lolwut factor to a whole 'nother level. Party wide cripple spam, I'm starting to believe the test krewe doesn't play much Guild Wars.

miriforst · Feb 25, 2011, 05:31 AM // 05:31

Ahh abusage... I like it.

This build looks interesting, its like a grenths grasp volley but with barrage so you don't have to sacrifice your elite since you could probably do fine with volley as well. Incendiary is also interesting but would require too much attribute split for my taste.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zodiac Meteor

I loved the fact they NERFED crippling shot because it was to OP.

The skill is already pretty beastly on Assassin. But in PvP games like HA or GvG this takes lolwut factor to a whole 'nother level. Party wide cripple spam, I'm starting to believe the test krewe doesn't play much Guild Wars.

yes, why did they nerf one of the few really good ranger elites left? Seriously what where they thinking when they remade the dervish? Every skill seems to have at least two functions virtually doubling their skill slots. And its instant, costs 4 energy for a dervish with 10 in mysticism and cripples moving foes no matter what weapon you use. Thats already good enough, but hey! Lets also make it remove cripple 100% AND another condition. They seem to like to take good skills and add another skills function as well. Grenths grasp + antidote signet in a nonelite ftw...